Wall Observer

[Matthew Light]

the ETH bubble will completely deflate at least in BTC terms

not only is the $$$ value of eth in a massive bubble that will surely correct back down to at least 5$ but BTC value will rise, so for BTC/ETH it going to be horrific!

Ethereum scales, has sane developers, is not beholden to bought-off Chinese miners, has a 15 second block time versus 10 minutes (targeting a few seconds next year when it switches to proof-of-stake).

Re: Counterparty Turing Complete, Anyone have any thoughts about the counterparty press release today? I wanted to understand if it required any additional functionality from BTC to work; but from my nascent understanding and reading of it... it does not. So, we can have btc + ethereum smart contracts, without LN?

Counterparty is useful if you can wait 10-30 minutes for a Bitcoin confirmation, depending on network congestion. There's simply no there, there.

 

[Tomothy]

I think you are right in terms of progress being made one way or another. I guess my question would be if whether or not bitcoin is still bitcoin if it scales off chain with segwit/ln or on chain. This whole Segwit 4mb blocks 3mb reserved for segwit and 1mb reserved for everything else seems shady as hell when you look at something like counterparty. Unfortunately I don't know much about Counterparty but I'm assuming it is tied to btc and to btc transaction on chain and party off chain. So Segwit would steal 3/4 of available data for itself and leave 1/4 for other applications runnning that are not segwit. I have to not be understanding something but this seems crazy. Like segwit/LN is a pre-emptive attack to secure future blockstream dominance. Again however, this assumes counterparty requires using parts of a btc transaction. So i guess, yes, progress is getting made but essentialy at issue is the future of bitcoin. Is it blockstream coin or is it bitcoin because they have started to look very different. Am I wrong? Someone tell me why i'm wrong. I have to be wrong lol.

 

[JayJuanGee]

ya i think +600$ by end of april. a nice ramp up with a parabolic finish topping out in the 700's

next 48 hours spike up to like 430 stay above 420
flat for 72 hours
repeat.
[doublepost=1458232570][/doublepost]is the market crazy enough to consider the core devs are not trying to scale the main chain, they are trying to put in place what is nessary for second layer.

dose market even care if we scale with a second layer or if we scale main chain?

the segwit Vs 2MB , second layer Vs main chain scaling, is quite possibly mostly irrelevant to price...
[doublepost=1458232711][/doublepost]from a speculator point of view, the way in which we move forward on scaling is not relevant.
agreed?

at least in the mid term its not relevant.

the unforeseen consequences of either solution can't be priced in... all we can price is the fact that one way or another progress will be made.

Did anyone ever believe that actual scaling was an issue affecting BTC prices?

Except for on the margins, I really doubt it.

Recently (in the past 2 months) negative BTC price pressures have merely been created by a bunch of negative hype surrounding the scaling/governance issue (causing uncertainties concerning overall BTC stability/future), rather than any actual technical issue concerning scaling alone (demonstrated by Hearn rage quit, etc... ).

 

[adamstgbit]

Ethereum scales

look at the road map
ether will tackle scaling later, much later...

 

[Tomothy]

Re: Eth & Counterparty
- So I kindof agree with you and don't at the same time. My understanding is that due to it's inflationary nature, Ethereum is not a proper store of value but is great at smart contracts. So. Enter Counterparty. Counterparty runs ethereum smart contracts on bitcoin. So, i'm assuming they can use the security and value of bitcoin with counterparty and eth for smart contracts? I.e., bitcoin is the building block holding everything together as it currently stands. Does this change if segwit/ln is implemented or would this help foster this weird symbiotic relationship. I.E. are counterparty contracts interchangeable with ethereum and are they both able to interact with one another. It seems like maybe there's a bridge between them now just speculating, but that seems like moon, except for, well... whatever is going on with blockstream's stuff. Has ethereum or counterparty commented on segwit/ln/scaling of bitcoin? I should do a search later.

 

[adamstgbit]

Did anyone ever believe that actual scaling was an issue affecting BTC prices?

Except for on the margins, I really doubt it.

Recently (in the past 2 months) negative BTC price pressures have merely been created by a bunch of negative hype surrounding the scaling/governance issue (causing uncertainties concerning overall BTC stability/future), rather than any actual technical issue concerning scaling alone (demonstrated by Hearn rage quit, etc... ).

agreed.

i would go as far as saying market fucked up, they saw the debating as bearish, when infact its a necessary first step...
wake up! its bullish that everyone is going nuts trying to come to the best possible solution.
some are strongly opinionated and hardheaded and say things like "its my way or the highway", " 2MB or bitcoin will die" emotional outbursts is all that is.

I feel strongly about scaling the main chain before second layer, but i'm not going to start selling coins simply because it doesn't play out Exactly as i though it should....

 

[Matthew Light]

BTW, the counterparty news today is apparently bogus:

[doublepost=1458235888][/doublepost]

So I kindof agree with you and don't at the same time. My understanding is that due to it's inflationary nature, Ethereum is not a proper store of value but is great at smart contracts.

Ether token creation rate today is less than Bitcoin's the first 4 years. When proof-of-stake is released in the next year, token creation rate will go to between 0-2%, which is less than Bitcoin's token creation rate will be until sometime in the mid-late 2020 or early 2030s.

 

[JimboToronto]

Finally, over $420. It's about time.

 

[adamstgbit]

Ether token creation rate today is less than Bitcoin's the first 4 years. When proof-of-stake is released in the next year, token creation rate will go to between 0-2%, which is less than Bitcoin's token creation rate will be until sometime in the mid-late 2020 or early 2030s.

pretty sure ether creates more than 25 coin every 10 mins....
and supply STARTED start off with like what was it 50million?
you're talking about inflation rate, (yearly?) its easy to have a low inflation rate when you start off with 50million coins....
[doublepost=1458237308][/doublepost]forget it poeple ETH is done, it won't go back over 0.03BTC unless its clear that it will displace bitcoin. aka NEVER AGAIN

 

[ChartBuddy]

Coin

 

[adamstgbit]

Finally, over $420. It's about time.

Annnnnd its gone!

 

[Dotto]

BTW, the counterparty news today is apparently bogus:

[doublepost=1458235888][/doublepost]

Ether token creation rate today is less than Bitcoin's the first 4 years. When proof-of-stake is released in the next year, token creation rate will go to between 0-2%, which is less than Bitcoin's token creation rate will be until sometime in the mid-late 2020 or early 2030s.

Yep, but the actual number of eth tokens, today, is 360% bigger that all bitcoins in existence in 2140

 

[Matthew Light]

Yep, but the actual number of eth tokens, today, is 360% bigger that all bitcoins in existence in 2140

So we should all use OneCoin then, right?

 

[JimboToronto]

Annnnnd its gone!

And back again... at least momentarily.

 

[Matthew Light]

forget it poeple ETH is done, it won't go back over 0.03BTC unless its clear that it will displace bitcoin. aka NEVER AGAIN

Almost everyone on this forum came into Bitcoin from 2009-2013. Most of you have made 10x-1000x or more on your investment. That deeply colors your viewpoint on the cryptocurrency marketplace.

Bitcoin can't grow. Unless that is fixed, very soon, Bitcoin's market-cap primacy is finished within the next year.

Oh, and ETH/BTC will be over 0.04 before summer.
[doublepost=1458241170][/doublepost]

pretty sure ether creates more than 25 coin every 10 mins....
and supply STARTED start off with like what was it 50million?
you're talking about inflation rate, (yearly?) its easy to have a low inflation rate when you start off with 50million coins....

Inflation percentage rate is what matters, and individual "coin" count is completely arbitrary, since one can measure Bitcoin balances in mBTC, µBTC or Satoshis.

 

[rebuilder]

pretty sure ether creates more than 25 coin every 10 mins....
and supply STARTED start off with like what was it 50million?
you're talking about inflation rate, (yearly?) its easy to have a low inflation rate when you start off with 50million coins....

Who cares, at this point, how many coins Ethereum was started off with? That's surely priced in, right? Inflation rate going forward should be all that matters as far as supply is concerned.

 

[adamstgbit]

And back again... at least momentarily.

its a fairly smooth ride up... we'll be up and over 420 "forever" by the end of the day.

 

[JayJuanGee]

Yep, but the actual number of eth tokens, today, is 360% bigger that all bitcoins in existence in 2140

Because I had seen the number of Ethers go up by more than 1 million in recent times (in less than 1 month), I searched a little bit to attempt to get some kind of explanation regarding how ethers are generated... and there's a shit load of them generated.

https://www.cryptocompare.com/coins/guides/how-do-currency-ether-units-get-issued-in-ethereum/

Started out with 60 million, and 300 ethers every 10 minutes and more than 1 million per month.


Lots of those little fuckers around.

 

[adamstgbit]

Who cares, at this point, how many coins Ethereum was started off with? That's surely priced in, right? Inflation rate going forward should be all that matters as far as supply is concerned.

market cap cares?
ETH had a 10X run up after a 5X from IPO
I do not think it can sustain a 1billion dollar market cap, its over, or soon to be over.
I can see this thing run to 30$ but it won't be there more than a few mins....
buy high sell higher is a dangerous game

 

[rebuilder]

Adam: I'm not advocating ETH here, it's just that market cap is price x total units issued, and price is demand vs supply. So if the supply was lower, presumably the market cap would be the same and the unit price would be higher.