Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP.

Peter R

Well-Known Member
Aug 28, 2015
1,398
5,595
Do any readers here know David Graeber (I am looking for an introduction)? He is the author of Debt: The First 5,000 Years (which I think is the book that inspired Wences Casares' "money as a ledger" video). David was a lead figure in the Occupy Wall Street protests, and he is Professor of Anthropology at the London School of Economics.
 
Last edited:

lunar

Well-Known Member
Aug 28, 2015
1,001
4,290
A bit more info about the 21 business model. https://21.co/
Introducing the First Bitcoin Computer
The 21 Bitcoin Computer is the first computer with native hardware and software support for the Bitcoin protocol.
Can I run the 21 Bitcoin Computer as a full node?
Yes, which is why it comes with a full copy of the Blockchain pre-loaded on a 128GB SD card. The computer will briefly synchronize with the network when you plug it in, after which point it will run as a full node by default without further intervention.
Should be good for the full node count. XT or Core ? ;-)
 

theZerg

Moderator
Staff member
Aug 28, 2015
1,012
2,327
@awemany : I agree with Bloomie. Start a new thread and just keep revising the first post as you collect more information. I think this would be a worthwhile effort!
Don't do that! As we all know, the security of the system is stronger if you create new blocks rather than continually re-mining the same one with more information :D

If we made a GCBU "blockchain" would u use it?
 
  • Like
Reactions: AdrianX and awemany

awemany

Well-Known Member
Aug 19, 2015
1,387
5,054
A bit more info about the 21 business model. https://21.co/
[...]
Should be good for the full node count. XT or Core ? ;-)
If that is really their main product, they must absolutely support a strong increase in blocksize. Else their hardware will be worthless - they are actually talking about micropayments on the blockchain, something I only see as being sustainable with something like LN plus bigger blocks in place.

Supposedly, they've been announcing BIP100 support in their blocks? I really wonder what their stance is on all the proposals - again, their whole business model very strongly relies on a scalable Bitcoin.
 

Zarathustra

Well-Known Member
Aug 28, 2015
1,439
3,797

lunar

Well-Known Member
Aug 28, 2015
1,001
4,290
@awemany

his response on the AMA request is quite a good read

I believe they currently vote for BIP100 ? Thus giving them some control over the direction of the blocksize. Although I agree there must be more to this. Perhaps a dedicated micro channel of some sort? Otherwise, all their machines could potentially be knocked off the network when blocks are close to full.
 
  • Like
Reactions: awemany

sickpig

Active Member
Aug 28, 2015
926
2,541
@lunarboy thanks for the link.

on the actual content: "think of a mining chip as a kind of transformer. turn power from the wall into Bitcoin: (...) no ads, no signup", mind blowing in its simplicity.
 
  • Like
Reactions: AdrianX

cypherdoc

Well-Known Member
Aug 26, 2015
5,257
12,998
the turmoil returns:

 

cypherdoc

Well-Known Member
Aug 26, 2015
5,257
12,998
It's amazing to me how many idiots on reddit think this is solely a mining device.

Trolls/idiots are everywhere now, there's hardly anyone left doing rational discourse.

I'm pretty pumped to see the software side of that chip.
agreed.

from a hardmoney perspective, i'm old enough to remember being able to mine on my laptop with cpu. you'd download the blockchain, mine rewards, and rec/spend when convenient. other than that, you were left wondering what to do with Bitcoin. but it wasn't considered profitable then either. your fans were whirring away causing alot of noise, it was hot, and it could slow down your processing speeds. but that was just a reflection of the time when the price was under a dollar.

now, 21 has essentially created another this time dedicated laptop whose mining certainly doesn't appear to be profitable, except for the fact that those satoshis could become quite valuable one day. however, the really powerful addition and hope is that devs, and eventually consumers, use these devices to harness the non-hardmoney aspects of Bitcoin that we all want to see happen thru it's payment network capabilities. it's an all-inclusive Bitcoin platform that allows experimentation via API's, marketing and selling of digital products, and a direct sourcing of coin thru mining. now we can actually do something with those satoshi's we're collecting.

the really cool thing that 21 has conceived is elimination of the variance of mining that all miners have come to fear. waiting to get a block can tax one's patience and nerve. pools eliminate that and 21 is willing to smooth that even further by making the income a "continuous stream", whatever that exactly means. plus, the big thing is that these are portable. don't expect owners of these to be paying alot for electricity. instead, i see alot of these popping up at Starbucks and at workstations around the globe. we went thru this discussion many months ago when we talked about this back when we thought these were going to be confined to smartphones.

it really is a brilliant scheme and will be hugely beneficial for Bitcoin.

remember that every day that goes by and Bitcoin doesn't die is a day it gets stronger. that's b/c each day it doesn't die, is a day that new Bitcoin innovation is allowed to grow and flourish and come to the forefront.

200 is the new 2 and we're just basing getting ready for the next 10x ramp.
 

Inca

Moderator
Staff member
Aug 28, 2015
517
1,679
It is certainly exciting to see there is a lot of development and fresh ideas at 21.co

Looking forward to bitcoin unexpectedly rallying up once again. It has been so long now that people cannot remember the excitement of april/december 2013. That is a good thing IMO.

EDIT: my weekly allowance just rose to $3000, thanks Circle!
 
Last edited:

Peter R

Well-Known Member
Aug 28, 2015
1,398
5,595
"Think of a mining chip as a kind of transformer. Turn power from the wall into Bitcoin: convenient micropayments." --Balaji Srinivasan

I had a very interesting conversation with a guy from China during the Scaling Bitcoin conference. What his company did (I don't recall the company's name) was set-up hydroelectric facilities in remote Chinese locations with Bitcoin mining equipment.

He told me that in rural China, there are a large number of hydroelectric generators producing more energy than they can sell to local industry (the transmission grid in China is not like North America and Europe). When these facilities have more electricity than demanded, and if the reservoir is already full, then they can either mine bitcoins or just let the water spill over the dam!

His company sets up a mining facility and then shares 20% of the mined bitcoins with the hydroelectric company! He told me that he thinks bitcoins will start to be seen as the "energy currency." For example, his customers (the hydropower producers) think of a bitcoin as "the stored energy of 20 tons of water." I thought that was a pretty cool visual. It took 20 tons of water flowing through my dam's turbine to produce this bitcoin!

He told me the hydropower producers love bitcoin because they see it as a way to store their power, rather than wasting it.
 
Last edited:

Peter R

Well-Known Member
Aug 28, 2015
1,398
5,595
I wanted to spend some time today chatting bitcoin online. But it seems like it's dead everywhere: here, bitcointalk, /r/bitcoin, /r/bitcoinxt. Where is everyone?
 

lunar

Well-Known Member
Aug 28, 2015
1,001
4,290
Great story Peter.

Sums up why I believe we should not be too worried about 'mining centralisation' Energy is free or surplus at certain times of the day for many people around the world, as more renewables come online this will only increase. A mining chip IS essentially a transformer. I can't see economies of scale competing with decentralised 'free energy'.
Any spare power can now be converted into value and sold or stored. There are still a few efficiency blips on the on the way, but it's not hard to imagine offices, factories or farms with a 'mining transformer' converting unused solar or wind power into bitcoin.
 

Peter R

Well-Known Member
Aug 28, 2015
1,398
5,595
@ lunarboy

Yes, absolutely. A dev from Armory joined the conversation with the Chinese miner and mentioned that there are certain times when nuclear power plants in the US will actually pay you to take electricity from them. Imagine setting up a mining facility near to one of these plants and not only getting free electricity to earn bitcoins with, but actually getting a USD cheque from the power plant too!

I think there is a lot of room for innovation in bitcoin mining.
 
  • Like
Reactions: AdrianX and ladoga

theZerg

Moderator
Staff member
Aug 28, 2015
1,012
2,327
Last edited:

cypherdoc

Well-Known Member
Aug 26, 2015
5,257
12,998
"Think of a mining chip as a kind of transformer. Turn power from the wall into Bitcoin: convenient micropayments." --Balaji Srinivasan

I had a very interesting conversation with a guy from China during the Scaling Bitcoin conference. What his company did (I don't recall the company's name) was set-up hydroelectric facilities in remote Chinese locations with Bitcoin mining equipment.

He told me that in rural China, there are a large number of hydroelectric generators producing more energy than they can sell to local industry (the transmission grid in China is not like North America and Europe). When these facilities have more electricity than demanded, and if the reservoir is already full, then they can either mine bitcoins or just let the water spill over the dam!

His company sets up a mining facility and then shares 20% of the mined bitcoins with the hydroelectric company! He told me that he thinks bitcoins will start to be seen as the "energy currency." For example, his customers (the hydropower producers) think of a bitcoin as "the stored energy of 20 tons of water." I thought that was a pretty cool visual. It took 20 tons of water flowing through my dam's turbine to produce this bitcoin!

He told me the hydropower producers love bitcoin because they see it as a way to store their power, rather than wasting it.
so does this mean you constructed the last slide of your presentation right then and there?;)
 

sickpig

Active Member
Aug 28, 2015
926
2,541
  • Like
Reactions: solex