Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP.

[Christoph Bergmann]

Great article @Christoph Bergmann! You are one of very few people who actually understands how KaChing works.

Article in German, Google Translate is your friend:
https://bitcoinblog.de/2019/11/12/die-zahlung-auf-den-kopf-gestellt-chipkartenzahlungen-mit-btc-bch-und-bsv/

Thanks. To be honest, it was not easy to understand how it works, I had to make several guesses, educated from your posts here and there. Your documentation is good in practical details, but it lacks a more abstract description of the transactional concept.

I think kaching works better than than now pumped becash Smartcard. It's heavily underrated, I hope you make it to get it rolled out

 

[Norway]

Thanks @Christoph Bergmann. We do have three levels of explanations on our website (press release, manual for the protocol in English and Chinese, the protocol). But as you say, we don't give a high-level description of the transactional concept. We'll do that in the future. PS. Something with KaChing will happen in less than a week.

 

[Christoph Bergmann]

Looking forward to it. We (b2029.org) collect all bsv news for the German metanetweekly newsletter. If I miss the news, write me a DM with Twitter. That's the best way to reach me.

 

[sgbett]

i'll be honest; sometimes i wish CSW would just shut the fuck up. this talk about miners seizing coins based on gvt edict creates all sorts of confusion. personally, i don't think it's possible to get such widespread cooperation; like if the USG wants to stop donations to Wikileaks for leaking USG sensitive data. why would others agree with that, esp since they may actually want that. along with many other fine distinctions where other gvts just might not want to cooperate or have a broader view of what crypto can accomplish for the greater good. it would be a hella risky strategy for any single gvt to try and spearhead a seizure of specific coins imo. the best time to have done shit like this was over the last 11y, like with Ulbricht, or now with maybe Tether. i think it's too late for this so why does CSW fan the flames? either he isn't Satoshi and doesn't know WTF he's talking about or he is and is trying to placate gvts. i don't know which and i don't care. by my best estimation, BSV is on track with or w/o him.

PS: this exact debate was discussed ad nauseum way back btwn the years of 2010-2013, over and over and over...
[doublepost=1573604683][/doublepost]maybe the USG wants an intact, functioning BitCoin with all it's public transparency as an enhanced aid in rooting out real criminals and eliminating inflation (imagine that!). it would take some really smart advanced thinkers within TPTB to envision/want a possible end to debt based inflation and it's associated armageddon.

I think this is around how he (and/or his team) perceives relative importance of "the institution" to that of "society" (by which I'm inferring the social media side of things).

The longer it goes an and the more inevitable Bitcoin's success becomes, the more important I think it is to do the legwork now on setting the stage is if it is already global cash. From what it seems I think that has been going on behind closed doors for years. More recently knowledge of it seems to have drifted into the public awareness.

So I think he sees those flames as unimportant - I suspect because he has inside knowledge of just how much of a foothold Bitcoin has in becoming the dominant - and perhaps only - cryptocurrency. (At least in terms of "only one worth paying attention to" - i'm sure some hobbyist stuff may persist purely because its not even worth shutting down.)

It seems clear to me that if we are going to consider decentralisation in any context, its that of governments - they are the decentralised governance of bitcoin, they are the ones deciding the rules (international law) and miners are just complying with law in the most profitable way they can.

So to that end I think CSW is already move(s) ahead - he did the social bit to get it bootstrapped with the nerds (mysterious Japanese creator, so cryptography, many secure). The misinterpretation of its anonymity led to criminals driving the next wave(s) of growth (double edged sword that! one for the historians) The final transition has to be in the context of global acceptance by world governments and so thats why he is prioritising them.

 

[cypherdoc]

Why do you believe that Bitcoin will stop debt creation?
Whether money is backed by cattle, grain, silver, gold, debt contracts, electricity etc. doesn't change the fact that economies/societies always rise and fall with debt creation/debt destruction.

it won't but hopefully it will eliminate the Armageddon part of it by providing a much more effective audit trail for lending ratios than gold ever did.

 

[Zangelbert Bingledack]

Excellent article by Craig today (Seb P is getting good at editing him so it's uncharacteristically readable). He obviously has his finger on the Twitter pulse today.

https://craigwright.net/blog/law-regulation/proof-of-assignment/

I think one reason CSW is pushing the code-is-not-law angle now is that it really is a key piece to understanding the big picture and the practicalities of design for layers above Bitcoin. Right now many services and startups are being launched on BSV and he probably wants to ensure they aren't being built naively. He's been pounding the table about this for years, intermittently, but he tends to become more and more aggressive with his message until it's heard.

 

[freetrader]

I think kaching works better than than now pumped becash Smartcard.

What's your reasoning behind thinking it works better?

 

[kostialevin]

We are on track... 2 public testnets will be launched in the next 2 weeks with beta code not long after then a long test cycle begins which we'll be inviting public to participate in. In parallel we'll have a security audit of all the new code. We'll be heating up the comms channels on this in the next few days...

Thanks a lot! Happy to know It!

 

[Norway]

It will be interesting to see how accurate Satoshi's niece' short term prediction is. Yesterday she predicted BSV to go down to about USD 115 today/tomorrow before a bull run. The drop today to USD 122 (independent of BTC) is very consistent with that prediction. Maybe she can make me reconsider my theory that all TA is bullshit?

Here is her prediction from yesterday:

 

[Christoph Bergmann]

What's your reasoning behind thinking it works better?

Becash is impressive, I like the design very much, it creates a secure direct debit system, where the seller can redeem the money. I'm sure it has a nice future. It was the first news from bch since long which excited me.

But it's not really that it solves urgent user problems with Smartcards. Kaching is fast enough (1.3 seconds), while Becash is a little <1 sec. Both runs on a basic chip card, both need a smartphone wallet to load up.

While kaching has more features. It allows the merchant to add signed receipts and to add other in and outputs to increase privacy.

Bsv, the statist coin, has a solution with better privacy than anarchist bch.
[doublepost=1573690393][/doublepost]@cypherdoc yes, I also wish sometimes he just shut up. I guess so does everybody around him... Don't think this is possible. At least not in 2020, if ever.

Someone mentioned segwit. Could it be possible for full nodes to just downgrade bitcoin to pre segwit, then sync the malsigned confiscating transaction, and go back to post segwit core?

 

[Zarathustra]

@Christoph Bergmann

> Bsv, the statist coin, has a solution with better privacy than anarchist bch.

They do not represent anarchy. They represent anomie, but they don't know it. Unfortunately even CSW doesn't know it. Anarchy is the world of self-sufficient blood-related communities before the Neolitic Revolution, or today in the rainforest. It works! They are not ruled by rulers outside the community.
An anarchist society, on the other hand, is an oxymoron. There is no such thing. Never ever in the history.

 

[trinoxol]

Very good points. I agree very much that Twitter seems to do damage to the character of people. We see abrasiveness and a lack of basic human decency in other discussion places besides Twitter now.

When I speak on the internet I try to imagine that I'm saying this to someone's face. That very quickly fixes any temptation to say nasty things.

 

[cypherdoc]

that's rich coming from Greg of all people
[doublepost=1573771942,1573771287][/doublepost]I just love the ABC extremists; bunch of radical irrationalists:

http://reddit.com/r/btc/comments/dwdmma/bitcoin_unlimited_vote_127_called_partially/
[doublepost=1573772267][/doublepost]hey @freetrader, just keep reintroducing this buip until you get it passed. just like your @Norway expulsion
[doublepost=1573772570][/doublepost]id love to see this buip passed. would be the fastest way to further centralize BCH dev by destroying what's left of BU.

 

[freetrader]

BU focusing on Bitcoin Cash is the opposite of centralizing BCH.

I'm glad we can focus on BCH dev without the BSV obstructionists.

Enjoy your coin (and I used to think Wuckert was a somewhat sane member of your cult, but I changed my mind today seeing this tweet LOL)


One thing I'll say is that BSV is still a bit coin. But just a bit.

 

[Zarathustra]

> I'm glad we can focus on BCH dev without the BSV obstructionists.

Yes, they would obstruct your network with transactions.
"Don't spam the network!"
https://bitinfocharts.com/de/comparison/transactions-bch-bsv.html#log&6m

 

[cypherdoc]

ahahaha, that's brutal
[doublepost=1573782756,1573781809][/doublepost]

One thing I'll say is that BSV is still a bit coin. But just a bit.

the only real bit is the itty-bitty blocks and iitty-bitty tx volume on BCH, BCH.

 

[Christoph Bergmann]

Oh, @freetrader, no answer to our discussion? Sad, I thought we could get peacefully back in technical discussions...

With output bills handcash introduces high privacy by default. Another chapter in the 'things are often the opposite of what they seem to be'

Same with identity: use cashaccounts, and you have no privacy. Use paymail, and you enjoy a great privacy.

It's like a universal law...

 

[cypherdoc]

BCH cucks are really something. they should be thankful BU supports them and ABC. instead, they ridicule, slander, ostracize BU from anything related to BCH dev. to top it off, they feel they have a right to force BU to whatever they want, simply because BU supports their coin. like regulate BU's membership, as with @Norway, and now tell BU to sell BTC for BCH. anyone with half a brain can see that BU is merely distributing their monies according to current market values and arguably risk. but no, BCH cucks demand an extremist all in approach for the privilege of receiving their abuse. yet) maybe the worst part is half of BU's leadership laps it up.

 

[cypherdoc]

 

[freetrader]

Oh, @freetrader, no answer to our discussion? Sad, I thought we could get peacefully back in technical discussions...

I don't check in here very often, but when I do I get called a BCH cuck. Kind of makes me disbelieve in intelligent life in this thread.

Thanks for your response though, I think be.cash is in early prototype stage so I'm wholly optimistic that its utility will eventually surpass Kaching.